A technologist, community lead, and EOR show us how to change the way the world works
Joel Kammeyer of Direct Collective on why contingent workforce leaders are not buyers, what 300+ program leaders ask each other, and why the human in the loop is the dataset. Plus the last three episodes and this week's reads.
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This week Matthew shared what 27 executives told us in Dallas, and Tony showed that headcount stalled while oversight climbed. Companies are asking for new types of talent solutions, strategies, and programs. Our latest guests show what that looks like. Here is where we would start this weekend.
This week on the Human Cloud Podcast
How Connection and Community Turn Contingent Buyers Into Leaders
Joel Kammeyer ran the contingent program at Epiq for seven years and built Cerner's from scratch. In June he took over community at Direct Collective, a curated network of 300+ contingent workforce leaders across the Fortune 500. This week Matthew sat down with him to find out what those leaders are asking each other, and why the word "buyer" has to go.
Joel reads the questions 300+ program leaders send each other every day, and three themes dominate:
| • Agentic AI inside the program. A hiring manager says "I need a contractor" and gets one sourced without opening a VMS form. |
| • Candidate fraud that no longer stops at onboarding. Bad actors who do the job for three months before the switch flips. |
| • The freelancer and SOW spend still outside the program. Our number for that is about 60% of flexible talent spend sitting unplanned and unaccounted for. |
The problem we couldn't stop thinking about: the data procurement leaders need doesn't ever make it to an LLM. It lives in leaders' heads. Which means workforce decisions will only get more, not less, complicated.
This is why we built Human Cloud. To be the trust and intelligence layer for the contingent workforce. Whether it's our podcast giving you access to the right people, or platform profiles giving you the data you need to find and vet the right solutions.
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"We're contingent workforce leaders. When we're talking in the contingent space, it's buyer and seller, and at the end of the day, we don't want to be known as buyers. We're leaders."
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Ready to tell your own story? Book your podcast episode →
Catch up on the last three episodes
Three more from the pod worth a weekend listen.
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September 26 Eric Ly, Co-Founder & CEO, KarmaCheck The LinkedIn co-founder on why credentialing, the least glamorous process in a hospital, is the one that decides its margin. Over 50 years the number of US providers stayed flat while administrators went up and to the right. |
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September 24 Kelly Monahan, Founder, Beyond the Desk Her clients are CIOs and CTOs, and they have run out of technology problems. What is left is work redesign, reskilling, and change management. With Tony Buffum. |
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September 22 Colin LaBeau, President, FoxHire An employer of record running since 1992 on why speed to talent, not the rate card, is the metric that decides whether flexible talent works. With Tony Buffum. |
Where to find us next
Tuesday, October 20 · 7:00 PM ET · New York · Invite only
Operating Partner Dinner at PEI New York
Twenty private equity operating partners and portfolio talent leaders at Del Frisco's Grille, alongside the PEI Operating Partners Forum. Hosted by Tony Buffum, chair of the forum, with Safeguard Global. If private equity portfolios are your buyers, this is the room.
Request an invite →Thursday, October 29 · 12:00 PM ET · Virtual
HC Community Call · October 2026
Where flexible talent fits amidst the broader talent ecosystem, why it has not crossed the chasm, and how solutions win in it without losing what makes you special.
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Featuring Ian Davidson Founder, Signol Labs · Making Candidate Data A Competitive Advantage |
Weekend Reads
From Matthew
• Last week 27 executives validated the need for a new talent ecosystem.
• AI searches fell 71%. HR doubled.
From Tony
• Headcount stalled. Oversight didn't.
From the industry
| • U.S. Adds Just 29,000 Jobs in September as Temp Help Keeps Shrinking CNBC · Oct 2 |
| • Challenger: September Layoffs Hit Four-Year Low, but Tech Cuts Keep Climbing Challenger, Gray & Christmas · Oct 1 |
| • ADP: Private Payrolls Rebound With 90,000 Jobs Added in September ADP · Sep 30 |
| • California Becomes First State to Bar AI-Only Firing Decisions CNBC · Sep 30 |
| • Connecticut's New AI Employment Law Takes Effect, Adding WARN Act AI-Disclosure Duty Workforce Bulletin, Epstein Becker Green · in effect Oct 1 |
| • Kelly Launches Kelly Digital Infrastructure as AI Accelerates Data Center Demand GlobeNewswire · Sep 30 |
| • Akkodis Completes Acquisition of Sogeclair's Airbus-Dedicated Engineering Unit GlobeNewswire · Oct 1 |
| • Second Federal Judge Blocks Trump's $100,000 H-1B Fee The Korea Times (Reuters) · Oct 1 |
Meet This Edition's Partner
Safeguard Global provides employer of record (EOR), global payroll, contractor payments, recruitment, entity setup, HR/benefits, and finance/tax/accounting services to help organizations hire and manage teams compliantly in 187 countries without needing local entities.
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